Ridley: "The Koran makes it crystal clear that women are equal"

But for journalist Yvonne Ridley, the ordeal in Afghanistan led her to convert to a religion she says is "the biggest and best family in the world".

The formerly hard-drinking Sunday school teacher became a Muslim after reading the Koran on her release.

She now describes radical cleric Abu Hamza al-Masri as "quite sweet really" and says the Taleban have suffered an unfair press.

Working as a reporter for the Sunday Express in September 2001, Ridley was smuggled from Pakistan across the Afghan border.

Afghanistan was about to be bombed and all [the Taleban] were concerned about was my big knickers Yvonne Ridley

But her cover was blown when she fell off her donkey in front of a Taleban soldier near Jalalabad, revealing a banned camera underneath her robes.

Her first thought as the furious young man came running towards her?

"Wow - you're gorgeous," she says.

"He had those amazing green eyes that are peculiar to that region of Afghanistan and a beard with a life of its own.

"But fear quickly took over. I did see him again on my way to Pakistan after my release and he waved at me from his car."

Ridley was working for the Sunday Express at the time of her capture

Ridley was interrogated for 10 days without being allowed a phone call, and missed her daughter Daisy's ninth birthday.

Of the Taleban, Ridley says: "I couldn't support what they did or believed in, but they were demonised beyond recognition, because you can't drop bombs on nice people."

It has been suggested the 46-year-old is a victim of Stockholm Syndrome, in which hostages take the side of the hostage-takers.

But she says: "I was horrible to my captors. I spat at them and was rude and refused to eat. It wasn't until I was freed that I became interested in Islam."

'Flappy knickers'

Indeed, the Taleban deputy foreign minister was called in when Ridley refused to take her underwear down from the prison washing line, which was in view of soldier's quarters.

"He said, 'Look, if they see those things they will have impure thoughts'."

"Afghanistan was about to be bombed by the richest country in the world and all they were concerned about was my big, flappy, black knickers.

"I realised the US doesn't have to bomb the Taleban - just fly in a regiment of women waving their underwear and they will all run off."

Once she was back in the UK, Ridley turned to the Koran as part of her attempt to understand her experience.

Abu Hamza: warned Ridley risked "hellfire" until she fully converted

"I was absolutely blown away by what I was reading - not one dot or squiggle had been changed in 1,400 years.

"I have joined what I consider to be the biggest and best family in the world. When we stick together we are absolutely invincible."

What do her Church of England parents in County Durham make of her new family?

"Initially the reaction of my family and friends was one of horror, but now they can all see how much happier, healthier and fulfilled I am.

"And my mother is delighted I've stopped drinking."

What does Ridley feel about the place of women in Islam?

"There are oppressed women in Muslim countries, but I can take you up the side streets of Tyneside and show you oppressed women there.

"Oppression is cultural, it is not Islamic. The Koran makes it crystal clear that women are equal."

And her new Muslim dress is empowering, she says.

"How liberating is it to be judged for your mind and not the size of your bust or length of your legs."

The reporter spent the first night of war in a prison cell in Kabul

A single mother who has been married three times, she says Islam has freed her from worry over her love life.

"I no longer sit and wait by the phone for a man to ring and I haven't been stood up for months.

"I have no man stress. For the first time since my teens I don't have that pressure to have a boyfriend or husband."

But there has been a phone call from at least one male admirer - north London preacher Abu Hamza al-Masri.

"He said, 'Sister Yvonne, welcome to Islam, congratulations'.

"I explained I hadn't yet taken my final vows and he said, 'Don't be pressured or pushed, the whole community is there for you if you need any help, just call one of the sisters.'

'Straight to hellfire'

"I thought, I can't believe it, this is the fire and brimstone cleric from Finsbury Park mosque and he is quite sweet really.

"I was just about to hang up when he said, 'But there is just one thing I want you to remember. Tomorrow, if you have an accident and die, you will go straight to hellfire'.

"I was so scared that I carried a copy of the vows in my purse until my final conversion last June."

And the hardest part of her new life?

"Praying five times a day. And I am still struggling to give up cigarettes."

The Abortion Wars Hit Illinois

In Illinois today, a federal judge is expected to hear an intriguing argument in the abortion debate. At issue: Is Aurora, Ill., a city of nearly 175,000 about an hour's drive west of Chicago, trying to stop Tuesday's scheduled opening of the nation's largest Planned Parenthood clinic because of political pressure from anti-abortion activists? Or was the clinic's true nature — that is, its Planned Parenthood genesis — not readily apparent to city officials when they originally approved permits for the building? Or is it a bit of both? The case is already one of the most heated in the nation's grassroots abortion wars, and protests in Aurora this past weekend drew hundreds of anti-abortion demonstrators.

Of course, Planned Parenthood is not just a company. And abortion opponents in this historically conservative suburb abutting cornfields were outraged. An assortment of groups, including churches, organized around-the-clock protests outside the clinic, which is tucked between a supermarket, a Blockbuster Video, and a cluster of upscale homes. The debate embroiled this city as has few other issues: City council meetings began drawing hundreds of abortion opponents.

And so, amid the outcry over alleged inconsistencies in the application and testimony of Planned Parenthood's executives, Aurora city officials announced on Aug. 30 that the clinic's opening would depend on a fresh review of its building permit. "These concerns were raised once this became high-profile, and people began looking back at the process," says Carie Anne Ergo, the city's spokeswoman. Last Wednesday, the city told Planned Parenthood it "had no intention of allowing you to open for business," according to court documents. On Thursday Sept 13, Planned Parenthood responded with a lawsuit in U.S. District Court attempting to block the city's efforts to stop the clinic's opening, saying it was rooted in discrimination because the clinic would perform abortions.

Shortly after dawn on Saturday, hundreds of abortion opponents arrived at the clinic, which many people on all sides of the debate have started calling "Ground Zero." Some simply prayed on the sidewalk behind the clinic. Many carried signs reading, KEEP ABORTIONS OUT OF AURORA. Cheryl Hartnett, a 52-year-old Aurora retiree, said her "heart broke" when she learned the clinic is owned by Planned Parenthood. "There will be political consequences" for city officials, she warned Saturday, surrounded by a clutch of protesters. Meanwhile, people who live in the homes near the clinic are fearful of potential violence. For much of the weekend, police officers stood guard in front of the entrance to a subdivision behind the clinic.

In an interview, Steve Trombley, CEO of Planned Parenthood's Chicago branch, said his group initially used Gemini to shield the building's contractors and employees from harassment. "I was surprised our opponents didn't figure us out sooner — they monitor our every move," he said Saturday, standing in the clinic's spare, manila-colored lobby. "We answered every question the city asked. This is about political pressure form anti-abortion group," he said of efforts to block the clinic's opening. Abortion opponents say they could recall few cases in which Planned Parenthood used subsidiaries to open clinics. A Planned Parenthood spokeswoman said the use of subsidiaries to open clinics isn't part of a new national strategy, and that "affiliates use different approaches to meet the health care needs of communities."

Last year, Planned Parenthood provided birth control to about 2.5 million patients nationwide. The group says abortions accounted for 3% of its services nationally last year. Elsewhere in the country, abortion opponents have opened so-called crisis pregnancy centers, often next to Planned Parenthood clinics, to persuade women headed for abortions to reconsider the procedure.

In Aurora, abortion opponents promise their protests will continue even as Planned Parenthood says at least a dozen patients have made appointments for Tuesday. Across the city, meanwhile, the clinic seems to dominate conversation. "I'm shocked we're involved in the middle of this," Rick Lawrence, a city alderman, says.

Ingrid Mattson: What is Islam?

October 18, 2001 Posted: 4:03 PM EDT (2003 GMT)

Ingrid Mattson is a professor of Islamic Studies at Hartford Seminary. In 1995, she was an adviser to the Afghan delegation to the United Nations Commission on the Status of Women. The vice president of the Islamic Society of North America, Professor Mattson is a contributor to The Muslim World Journal. She joined the CNN.com chat room from Connecticut.

CNN: Dr. Mattson, could you give us a basic explanation of Islam?

MATTSON: Islam is a global religion practiced by approximately 1.2 billion people in the world. Religious scholars consider it one of the Abrahamic religions meaning that, like Judaism and Christianity, it traces its primary beliefs back to the message of monotheism promoted by the prophet Abraham.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: How do you react to criticism that westerners do not understand Islam?

MATTSON: I don't think that's true of all Westerners, any more than it's true that all Muslims have a misunderstanding of western culture or American life. Unfortunately, there are misunderstandings that often are the result of the limited images of each culture that are shown or promoted in the general media.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: How had bin Laden duped so many Islamic people into believing his war of terrorism is in the name of Allah? The Koran, or at least my interpretation, disallows any killing of innocents, yet many Muslims feel the acts of September 11 were warranted.

MATTSON: I think that not many Muslims, only a small number of Muslims throughout the world would support Osama bin Laden's tactics. A larger number share the grievances that he has voiced, but they would share those grievances if they were voiced by any person. One of the reasons why some poor and marginalized people in the Muslim world have turned to Osama bin Laden as a spokesperson for their grievances, is because they feel that no one else, including their own leaders, has spoken for them.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: Can you give us a view of how many people convert to Islam from other religions, as opposed to Christianity?

MATTSON: I really wouldn't be in a position to give precise figures. What I do know is that according to many scholars, Islam is the fastest-growing religion in the United States.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: Does Islam ever promote violence and, if so, under what circumstances? If not, why do so many Muslims take up arms?

MATTSON: Islam allows force to be used by legitimate authorities, to protect people, and to protect Muslim states, just as all nation states in the world permit themselves to use force to protect their security and interests. Again, the problem of individual Muslims taking up arms, becoming vigilantes, in a way, is related to their frustration with the lack of leadership on the part of their own government.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: What legal rights do women have in Islam? The right to vote, work, own businesses?

MATTSON: Muslim women have the same legal rights as Muslim men. The Prophet Mohammed's wife was a businesswoman. In fact, he met her working for her as her agent. The legal rights of women were enshrined in Islamic law. However, cultural practices in many societies have prevented those rights from being enforced.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: What can you tell us about the Wahhabi sect of Islam? Is it true that this is an extremely right wing sect founded and funded by the Saudi royal family, and led by Osama bin Ladin? What is the purpose of the Wahhabi?

MATTSON: No it's not true to characterized 'Wahhabism' that way. This is not a sect. It is the name of a reform movement that began 200 years ago to rid Islamic societies of cultural practices and rigid interpretation that had acquired over the centuries. It really was analogous to the European protestant reformation. Because the Wahhabi scholars became intergreated into the Saudi state, there has been some difficulty keeping that particular interpretation of religion from being enforced too broadly on the population as a whole. However, the Saudi scholars who are Wahhabi have denounced terrorism and denounced in particular the acts of September 11. Those statements are available publicly.

This quesiton has arisen because last week there were a number of newspaper reports that were dealing with this. They raised the issue of the role of Saudi Arabia and the ideaology there. Frankly, I think in a way it was a reaction to the attempts of many people to look for the roots of terrorism in misguided foreign policy. It's not helpful, I believe, to create another broad category that that becomes the scape goat for terrorism.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: Is there a general feeling among the Muslims that the western world does not take them seriously?

MATTSON: I think that sometimes Muslims feel that their lives, their security, and their right to self-determination are not given very much weight by Western governments. Although, most Muslims would express appreciation for the ability of the average American to react empathetically to their causes.

CNN: Tell us about traditional Islamic dress. Why is it so varied, and so controversial to people of other cultures?

MATTSON: Traditional Islamic dress is modest dress, for men and women. It is considered appropriate public dress, so in the home, Muslims dress much more casually. The controversy arises when governments attempt to enforce a particular religious interpretation of proper Islamic dress on the population at large.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: At what point in history, if known, did the Islamic nation turn from a philosophical and educated state comparable to the Greeks to the now third world state it is in?

MATTSON: Well, the decline began with the colonization of the Muslim world by European powers. One of the first things the colonialists did was to dismantle the institutions of what we could call civil society. The Muslim world has until now not recovered from that dismemberment of its society.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: Jesus said: I am the way, the truth and the Life; no one comes to the Father but by me. What does Islam think of Christ?

MATTSON: It's a principle of faith for Muslims to believe that Jesus was sent by God as a righteous prophet. The Koran states that Jesus was born miraculously of the Virgin Mary, but the Koran states that none of the prophets were divine, including Jesus.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: Does the Taliban place blame upon women for the weakness of men in their society? Is that why they place such restriction upon them?

MATTSON: The Taliban place restrictions on everyone in their society, men and women. They've extended their authority over individuals far beyond traditional government in Afghanistan. In their minds, they are protecting women from other men by placing these restrictions on them.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: What possible justification can there be for the wholesale massacre of civilians in Islam?

MATTSON: There is no justification. It is prohibited in Islamic law. It is a great sin in Islamic theology. This has been stated before and after September 11 by leading Muslim scholars throughout the world. Osama bin Laden and his group are not considered scholars or legitimate interpreters of religion by the vast majority of Muslims in the world.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: Osama bin Laden made a reference that Muslims have been living in humiliation for 80 years. Did he refer to the Treaty of Sevres in 1920 that dismantled caliphates and sultanates?

MATTSON: Yes, he is referring to that, to the overthrowing of the caliphate, which was a plan of European powers for many years. This deprived the Muslim world of a stable and centralized authority, and much of the chaos that we're living in today is the result of that.

CHAT PARTICIPANT: What do you consider to be the best reference work on Islam -- apart from the Koran that is?

MATTSON: If someone wants to have access to a mainstream Muslim perspective, there's a really nice book called "Islam, the Natural Way," and the author is Abdulwahid Hamid. Another book is called "God is One," by Marston Speight.

CNN: Do you have any closing comments for us today?

MATTSON: I'd like to thank everyone for taking time to try to learn about Islam and about Muslims. The only way for all of us to find a way out of this crisis we're in is by understanding the world that we live in. Thank you.

CNN: Thank you!

Dr. Ingrid Mattson joined the chat room via telephone from Connecticut and CNN.com provided a typist. The above is an edited transcript of the interview on Thursday, October 18, 2001 at 11:30 a.m. EDT.